The Great Game: More historical theory

I respond to further comments on the historical plausibility or otherwise of the Yngling timeline.

Not sure if its that improbable. Its merely dynastical, familial control taken to an extreme.

Thank you! I’d also note that there are historical precedents for quite a bit of it : Junker Prussia has the landowner/military class, for example, as does Sparta, which also has the training-from-age-five bit. Rome did the bit with arming slaves when they got desperate enough, though with them it didn’t destroy the institution. (Mainly because when they won, the losers would become more slaves, which just isn’t practical in Norway – the land doesn’t really lend itself to huge plantations. Besides, the OTL development where it’s seen as immoral to take other Christians as slaves would go on here too.) And Rome had the class struggle, too, 2000 years before Marx. Athens and Venice for the aggressively expansionist ‘democracies’ dominated by an oligarchic class; Russia under the Rurikoviches for the single inter-related family in most noble titles.

Can’t you move Ynglings from the conquered lands to, say, America? Or are they left for the sake of building up a fifth column?

Well, in principle, yes. But are they going to want to move? By the treaties, they are allowed to keep a considerable portion of their lands – about as much as you can productively farm, really, without the repressive mechanisms keeping your peasants down. Besides, they have all the capital and farming equipment; they’ll still be pretty dominant, wealthy people, they just won’t be the only ones with political power. It takes a considerable amount of fanaticism to abandon all that for the life of a refugee in America, where all the good land is taken; and I don’t think the Ynglings have reached the modern level of ideology yet. Not enough propaganda apparatus for it, for one thing.

KoM, the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth 3/4th of the population were nobles, so that would be your closest example, but of course, they never were united as you depict the Ynglings to be.

Ack, I was just about to post about the szlachta, having just remembered them. You’re right about the unity, but then, they didn’t have me as their guiding spirit and propagandist. If it comes right to it, there were a few Ynglings back in CK who didn’t quite see eye to eye with me over who was boss. But we don’t talk about them. 😀


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